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Criticism of Mormonism/Books/American Massacre/Chapter 3: Difference between revisions
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====29==== | ====29 - Allen J. Stout's journal says that he will avenge Joseph's blood to the fourth generation==== | ||
{{ | {{IndexClaimItemShort | ||
|title=American Massacre | |||
|claim=Allen J. Stout's journal says that he will avenge Joseph's blood to the fourth generation. | |claim=Allen J. Stout's journal says that he will avenge Joseph's blood to the fourth generation. | ||
| | |authorsources= | ||
*From the cited source: | *Stout journal, June 28, 1844. | ||
}} | |||
From the cited source: | |||
<blockquote> | <blockquote> | ||
"Their dead bodies were brought to Nauvoo where I saw their beloved forms reposing in the arms of death, which gave me such feelings as I am not able to describe. But I there and then resolved in my mind that I would never let an opportunity slip unimproved of avenging their blood upon the head of the enemies of the Church of Jesus Christ. I felt as though I could not live. I knew not how to contain myself, and when I see one of the men who persuaded them to give up to be tried, I feel like cutting their throats. And I hope to live to avenge their blood, but if I do not, I will teach my children to never cease to try to avenge their blood and then their children and children's children to the fourth generation as long as there is one descendant of the murderers upon the earth." {{link|url=http://www.boap.org/LDS/Early-Saints/AStout.html}} | "Their dead bodies were brought to Nauvoo where I saw their beloved forms reposing in the arms of death, which gave me such feelings as I am not able to describe. But I there and then resolved in my mind that I would never let an opportunity slip unimproved of avenging their blood upon the head of the enemies of the Church of Jesus Christ. I felt as though I could not live. I knew not how to contain myself, and when I see one of the men who persuaded them to give up to be tried, I feel like cutting their throats. And I hope to live to avenge their blood, but if I do not, I will teach my children to never cease to try to avenge their blood and then their children and children's children to the fourth generation as long as there is one descendant of the murderers upon the earth." {{link|url=http://www.boap.org/LDS/Early-Saints/AStout.html}} | ||
</blockquote> | </blockquote> | ||
Stout vows vengeance only on "the murderers" and their kin. Despite his anger at those who had encouraged Joseph and Hyrum to surrender, he does not take action against them. The relevance of this to the Mountain Meadows Massacre is, then, not clear. | |||
====29==== | ====29==== | ||
{{IndexClaim | {{IndexClaim | ||
Revision as of 00:01, 7 December 2014
Response to claims made in "Chapter 3: Nauvoo, 1840"
| Chapter 2 | A FAIR Analysis of: American Massacre: The Tragedy at Mountain Meadows A work by author: Sally Denton
|
Chapter 4 |
23
Claim
Author's quote: Having suffered beatings and tarrings at the hands of Mormon baiters years earlier, and having faced impending death at various junctures, Smith sensed rightly that events in Nauvoo would be the grand finale of his life.
Author's source(s)
- No source provided.
Response
- Internal contradiction: The author earlier characterized Joseph's persecutions as "imaginary"
23 - Building a spired marble temple took precedence over everything else
The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:
Author's quote: Building a spired marble temple took precedence over everything else…
Author's sources: No source provided.
FAIR's Response
- History unclear or in error: the Nauvoo temple was made of limestone that was quarried locally, not marble which would have required importation.
23-24
Claim
Joseph's "falling out" with John C. Bennett is claimed to have been over a woman that "each desired as a plural wife."
Author's source(s)
- No source provided.
Response
- In fact, Bennett was given multiple opportunities to reform his ways before being excommunicated.
- For a detailed response, see: John C. Bennett
24
Claim
Nauvoo was claimed to be "the first genuine theocracy in American history."
Author's source(s)
- No source provided (but the analysis and claim are very reminiscent of Will Bagley, Blood of the Prophets: Brigham Young and the Massacre at Mountain Meadows (University of Oklahoma Press, 2002), 15.).
Response
- For a detailed response, see: Theocracy: Council of Fifty?
- For a detailed response, see: Theocracy: Nauvoo city charter?
- For a detailed response, see: Theocracy: power usurped at Nauvoo?
24 - The Council of Fifty was "a group of princes" who would rule the "Mormon empire"
The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:
The Council of Fifty was "a group of princes" who would rule the "Mormon empire."
Author's sources: *David L. Bigler, Forgotten Kingdom: The Mormon Theocracy in the American West, 1847–1896 (Logan, Utah: Utah State University Press, 1998), 24. (bias and errors) Review
FAIR's Response
- History unclear or in error: The Council of Fifty included non-Mormons as members.
Question: What was the Council of Fifty?
Joseph Smith received a revelation which called for the organization of a special council
On 7 April 1842, Joseph Smith received a revelation titled "The Kingdom of God and His Laws, With the Keys and Power Thereof, and Judgment in the Hands of His Servants, Ahman Christ," which called the for the organization of a special council separate from, but parallel to, the Church. Since its inception, this organization has been generally been referred to as "the Council of Fifty" because of its approximate number of members.
The Council of Fifty was designed to serve as something of a preparatory legislature in the Kingdom of God
Latter-day Saints believe that one reason the gospel was restored was to prepare the earth for the second coming of the Lord Jesus Christ. Just as the Church was to bring about religious changes in the world, the Council of Fifty was intended to bring a political transformation. It was therefore designed to serve as something of a preparatory legislature in the Kingdom of God. Joseph Smith ordained the council to be the governing body of the world, with himself as chairman, Prophet, Priest, and King over the Council and the world (subject to Jesus Christ, who is "King of kings"[1]).
The Council was organized on 11 March 1844, at which time it adopted rules of procedure, including those governing legislation. One rule included instructions for passing motions:
To pass, a motion must be unanimous in the affirmative. Voting is done after the ancient order: each person voting in turn from the oldest to the youngest member of the Council, commencing with the standing chairman. If any member has any objections he is under covenant to fully and freely make them known to the Council. But if he cannot be convinced of the rightness of the course pursued by the Council he must either yield or withdraw membership in the Council. Thus a man will lose his place in the Council if he refuses to act in accordance with righteous principles in the deliberations of the Council. After action is taken and a motion accepted, no fault will be found or change sought for in regard to the motion.[2]
What is interesting about this rule is that it required each council member, by covenant, to voice his objections to proposed legislation. Those council members who dissented and could not be convinced to change their minds were to withdraw from the council, however, they would suffer no repercussions by doing so. Thus, full freedom of conscience was maintained by the council — not exactly the sort of actions a despot or tyrant would allow.
The Council never rose to the stature Joseph intended
Members (which included individuals that were not members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints) were sent on expeditions west to explore emigration routes for the Saints, lobbied the American government, and were involved in Joseph Smith's presidential campaign. But only three months after it was established, Joseph was killed, and his death was the beginning of the Council's end. Brigham Young used it as the Saints moved west and settled in the Great Basin, and it met annually during John Taylor's administration, but since that time the Council has not played an active role among the Latter-day Saints.
25 - Joseph had himself ordained "king" during the time that he was running for President
The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:
Joseph had himself ordained "king" during the time that he was running for President.
Author's sources: No source provided.
FAIR's Response
Question: Was Joseph Smith anointed to be "King over the earth" by the Council of Fifty?
Joseph was never anointed King over the earth in any political sense
Some people claim that Joseph Smith had himself anointed king over the whole world, and that this shows he was some sort of megalomaniac.
The Council of Fifty, while established in preparation for a future Millennial government under Jesus Christ (who is the King of Kings) was to be governed on earth during this preparatory period by the highest presiding ecclesiastical authority, which at the time was the Prophet Joseph Smith. Joseph had previously been anointed a King and Priest in the Kingdom of God by religious rites associated with the fullness of the temple endowment, and was placed as a presiding authority over this body in his most exalted position within the kingdom of God (as a King and a Priest).
Joseph was anointed as the presiding authority over an organization that was to prepare for the future reign of Jesus Christ during the Millennium
The fact that Joseph's prior anointing was referenced in his position as presiding authority over this body creates the confusion that he had been anointed King of the Earth. He was in fact only anointed as the presiding authority over an organization that was to prepare for the future reign of Jesus Christ during the Millennium. The fact that Joseph had submitted his name for consideration as President of the United States during this same period adds fodder for critics seeking to malign the character of the Prophet.
25
Claim
Joseph had a "narcissistic" "theme of deceiving self and others."
Author's source(s)
- Robert D. Anderson, Inside the Mind of Joseph Smith, p. 225.
Response
- For a detailed response, see: Joseph Smith's supposed narcissism
26
Claim
Author's quote: Nauvoo, unlike Kirtland, had become the sanctuary for strange ceremonials and shrouded rites many members found increasingly alien and offensive…
Author's source(s)
- No source provided.
Response
- Internal contradiction: The author earlier stated that these things were introduced in Kirtland
- On page 14, speaking of Kirtland, the author states: "He then initiated the secret rituals that would further repel their conventional Christian neighbors-anointings, endowments, proxy baptisms, visions, healings, writhing ecstasies, and, especially, the concepts of 'eternal progression' and 'celestial marriage.'"
- History unclear or in error: Proxy baptisms were not introduced until Nauvoo, they were not known at Kirtland. Healings and visions were present from the Church's very beginnings. "Writhing ecstasies" were condemned by LDS scripture by 1831 (see DC 50).
26
Claim
A "Mormon historian," (Will Bagley) claims that celestial marriage "allowed the most ordinary backwoodsman to become a god and rule over worlds of his own creation with as many wives as his righteousness could sustain."
Author's source(s)
- Will Bagley, Blood of the Prophets: Brigham Young and the Massacre at Mountain Meadows (University of Oklahoma Press, 2002), 7.
- Compare treatment in Blood of the Prophets: p. 7.
Response
- Bagley is not a "Mormon historian"—his account is invariably hostile to LDS leaders and truth claims.
- For a detailed response, see: "Celestial sex"
- For a detailed response, see: "Rule over worlds of his own creation"?
- For a detailed response, see: Theosis or human deification
26
Claim
"One historian" (Will Bagley) claimed that Joseph "plunged into new sealings to married women, sisters, and very young girls."
Author's source(s)
- Will Bagley, Blood of the Prophets: Brigham Young and the Massacre at Mountain Meadows (University of Oklahoma Press, 2002), 27.
- Compare treatment in Blood of the Prophets: p. 27.
Response
- Prejudicial or loaded language
- Presentism or anachronism: "Marriages to very young girls"?
- For a detailed response, see: "Sealings to married women"
- For a detailed response, see: Divine manifestations to plural wives and their families
27
Claim
The founders of the Nauvoo Expositor were "men who knew too much."
Author's source(s)
- Will Bagley, Blood of the Prophets: Brigham Young and the Massacre at Mountain Meadows (University of Oklahoma Press, 2002), 16.
- Compare treatment in Blood of the Prophets: p. 16.
Response
- For a detailed response, see: Nauvoo Expositor
27
Claim
Author's quote: Smith ordered the Nauvoo Legion to storm the newspaper, destroy the press, and burn all extant issues.
Author's source(s)
- No source provided
Response
- History unclear or in error
- The Nauvoo City Council (which included some non-Mormon members) ordered the destruction of the Expositor.
- The suppression of the paper was legal for the day.
27
Claim
The author claims that "the constitutional defenders of the First Amendment" called for Joseph Smith's arrest after the destruction of the Expositor.
Author's source(s)
- No source provided.
Response
- The suppression of the paper was legal for the day.
- History unclear or in error: The First Amendment did not apply to local or state governments until after the Civil War.
28
Claim
The book claims that Joseph sent orders to the Nauvoo Legion from Carthage Jail to come and free him.
Author's source(s)
- No source cited, but it is probably Brodie. See Fawn M. Brodie, No Man Knows My History: The Life of Joseph Smith (New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1945), 392. ( Index of claims ).
Response
- The author's claim is false
- For a detailed response, see: Nauvoo Legion was to rescue Joseph?
28
Claim
The author claims that "lore had it" that Joseph gave the Masonic distress signal "before calling out: 'Oh Lord my God. Is there no help for the widow's son?"
Author's source(s)
- Fawn M. Brodie, No Man Knows My History: The Life of Joseph Smith (New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1945). ( Index of claims )
- D. Michael Quinn, The Mormon Hierarchy: Origins of Power (Signature Books, 1994), .
- Smith, Hallwas, Lanius.
Response
- History unclear or in error
- This is very sloppy research. Despite citing so many sources, the author gets the history wrong. There is no record of Joseph saying more than "Oh Lord, my God."
- In addition, the author states that Joseph gave the Masonic distress signal before calling out this phrase. In reality, the full phrase "Oh Lord my God. Is there no help for the widow's son" is the Masonic distress signal!
29
Claim
The author claims that Joseph's death was "second in importance only to that of Jesus Christ."
Author's source(s)
- Eliza Snow, Times and Seasons 5 (July 1, 1844), quoted in Hallwas and Launius, 237.
Response
- For a detailed response, see: Joseph Smith/Status in LDS belief
29 - Allen J. Stout's journal says that he will avenge Joseph's blood to the fourth generation
The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:
Allen J. Stout's journal says that he will avenge Joseph's blood to the fourth generation.
Author's sources: *Stout journal, June 28, 1844.
FAIR's Response
From the cited source:
"Their dead bodies were brought to Nauvoo where I saw their beloved forms reposing in the arms of death, which gave me such feelings as I am not able to describe. But I there and then resolved in my mind that I would never let an opportunity slip unimproved of avenging their blood upon the head of the enemies of the Church of Jesus Christ. I felt as though I could not live. I knew not how to contain myself, and when I see one of the men who persuaded them to give up to be tried, I feel like cutting their throats. And I hope to live to avenge their blood, but if I do not, I will teach my children to never cease to try to avenge their blood and then their children and children's children to the fourth generation as long as there is one descendant of the murderers upon the earth." off-site
Stout vows vengeance only on "the murderers" and their kin. Despite his anger at those who had encouraged Joseph and Hyrum to surrender, he does not take action against them. The relevance of this to the Mountain Meadows Massacre is, then, not clear.
29
Claim
D. Michael Quinn said that Joseph "failed to clarify for the highest leadership of the church the precise method of succession God intended."
Author's source(s)
- D. Michael Quinn, The Mormon Hierarchy: Origins of Power (Signature Books, 1994), 143.
Response
- For a detailed response, see: Succession in the Presidency of the Church
30
Claim
Sidney Rigdon is claimed to have "recently apostatized over Smith's attempted seduction of his daughter in to a polygamous marriage."
Author's source(s)
- No source provided.
Response
- The author's claim is false: Sidney had not apostatized. He remained first counselor in the First Presidency.
- For a detailed response, see: Joseph attempted to seduce Nancy Rigdon?
31
Claim
Author's quote: Knowing he could not compete with Smith as a seer...
Author's source(s)
- T.B.H. Stenhouse, 209.
Response
- Mind reading: author has no way of knowing this.
- Stenhouse (the author's source) did not become a member of the Church until after Joseph's death, and he joined the Church in England. He was in no position at all to know Sidney's thoughts or capabilities in the matter.
- The author's claim is false: Sidney's later post-Mormon religious activities show him to be quite convinced that he can deliver oracles from God as Joseph did.
32
Claim
The temple is claimed to have "placed under themost sacred obligations to avenge the blood of the Prophet, whenever an opportunity offered, and to teach their children to do the same."
Author's source(s)
- John D. Lee in Henrie, 147.
Response
- For a detailed response, see: Mormonism and temples/Endowment and Oath of vengeance
32
Claim
It is claimed that the "entire Mormon people [became] sworn and avowed enemies of the American nation."
Author's source(s)
- Lee in Henrie, 147.
Response
- Despite this claim, we soon learn that the Mormons volunteered for U.S. military service (see p. 47 below).
- For a detailed response, see: Sworn enemies of the United States?
36
Claim
Brodie's claim that when Brigham spoke in the Adamic language, it "thus acquired status in the Church."
Author's source(s)
- Fawn M. Brodie, No Man Knows My History: The Life of Joseph Smith (New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1945), 126. ( Index of claims )
Response
- Quotes another author's opinion as if it were fact
36
Claim
The author claims that Brigham "disposed of his rivals." Stanley P. Hirshson is quoted as claiming that Nauvoo became a "police state."
Author's source(s)
- Stanley P. Hirshson, "The Lion of the Lord," 61.
Response
- From the cited source:
Engulfed by dissension from within and without, Young established in Nauvoo a police state. When he returned to the town after Smith's death and was served with several writs, he strapped on a pair of six-shooters and vowed he would kill any man who handed him another summons or grabbed hold of him. Until he left Nauvoo, he wore those guns. (pp 61-62)
- Note the following from the Journal of Discourses:
"When the mantle of Joseph Smith fell upon Brigham Young, the enemies of God and His kingdom sought to inaugurate a similar career for President Young; but he took his revolver from his pocket at the public stand in Nauvoo, and declared that upon the first attempt of an officer to read a writ to him in a State that had violated its plighted faith in the murder of the Prophet and Patriarch while under arrest, he should serve the contents of this writ (holding his loaded revolver in his hand) first; to this the vast congregation assembled said, Amen. He was never arrested." (George A. Smith, Journal of Discourses 13:110.)
- For a detailed response, see: Nauvoo a police state?
36
Claim
The author claims that John D. Lee was "an integral component in the new power structure" after Joseph's death.
Author's source(s)
- No source provided.
Response
- The author must provide evidence for this assertion. Even if Lee was part of the LDS lay leadership, this does nothing to prove that his actions were sanctioned by his superiors.
37
Claim
The author claims that Emma and other Smith relatives returned to Far West and founded the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.
Author's source(s)
- No source provided.
Response
- History unclear or in error: The RLDS church was organized in Amboy, Illinois. Emma Smith lived in Nauvoo, Illinois until her death. Emma did not encourage or organize the RLDS church; when her son, Joseph Smith III, agreed to take its leadership, she traveled to the inaugural meeting to support him.
37
Claim
The author claims that Joseph wanted people to receive their endowments for the "Mormon road to heaven."
Author's source(s)
- Nelson Winch Green, "Fifteen Years Among the Mormons," 41.
Response
- Misrepresentation of source: The cited source says nothing about Joseph Smith at all. It is an anti-Mormon expose of the endowment ceremonies.
- The cited source is notoriously unreliable. Even the anti-Mormon Fanny Stenhouse wrote that Even the anti-Mormon Fanny Stenhouse wrote that the book "so mixed up fiction with what was true, that it was difficult to determine where one ended and the other began," and a good example of how "the autobiographies of supposed Mormon women were [as] unreliable" as other Gentile accounts, given her tendency to "mingl[e] facts and fiction" "in a startling and sensational manner." [3]
- The authors' poor grasp of LDS historiography, and poor historical judgment is again manifest.
37
Claim
It is claimed that LDS missionaries to England "capitalized on the intolerable social and economic conditions" in order to gain converts.
Author's source(s)
- Fawn M. Brodie, No Man Knows My History: The Life of Joseph Smith (New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1945), 264. ( Index of claims )
Response
- Quotes another author's opinion as if it were fact
- Brodie's claim oversimplifies a great deal. Charles Dickens described LDS immigrants as "the pick and flower of England." Immigration was also not a matter of instant financial benefits.
- For a detailed response, see: Economics of LDS immigration
38
Claim
Quoting D. Michael Quinn, the author notes that Brigham said that women "have no right to meddle in the affairs of the Kingdom of God."
Author's source(s)
- D. Michael Quinn, The Mormon Hierarchy: Origins of Power (Signature Books, 1994), 650.
Response
- Misrepresentation of source: Quinn provides a more extensive citation which the author omits.
- For a detailed response, see: Brigham Young: Women not to meddle?
38
Claim
The author claims that Brigham "commended his police for nearly beating to death an apostate within the walls of the temple.
Author's source(s)
- No source provided.
Response
- Although the author provides no source for the claim, it is likely that this refers to the flogging of three men by Nauvoo Police.
- For a detailed response, see: Flogging those out of fellowship?
38-39
Claim
The author mentions "the pending indictment of two leaders of the Church on counterfeiting charges..."
Author's source(s)
- No source provided.
Response
- Although the author provides no source for the claim, it is likely that this refers a critical claim that Brigham Young, Willard Richards, Parley Pratt, and Orson Hyde were involved in making counterfeit coins.
- For a detailed response, see: Counterfeiting by the apostles at Nauvoo?
39
Claim
The author claims that "thousands of armed Mormons and Gentiles faced off" in Nauvoo.
Author's source(s)
- No source provided.
Response
- Presentism or anachronism: Everyone on the frontier in 19th century America was armed—this was necessary for hunting and protection.
- The Saints were driven out of Nauvoo by the threat of military force.
Notes
- ↑ See 1 Timothy 6:15; Revelation 17:14; 19:16
- ↑ Andrew F. Ehat, "'It Seems Like Heaven Began on Earth': Joseph Smith and the Constitution of the Kingdom of God," Brigham Young University Studies 20 no. 3 (1980), 260-61.
- ↑ Stenhouse, "Tell It All", x-xii, 618, the footnote on the latter page confirms the identity of the author as Ettie V. Smith, whose account supposedly formed the basis for Green's work.